Brad and Barry talk new music, vinyl and festivals with Ed O'Brien from Radiohead and Jesse and Melanie from the Rust and Wax record shop at The What Podcast. (We promise it's Ed O'Brien in the video)
A podcast for Bonnaroovians by Bonnaroovians. Welcome to the What Podcast. A very interesting time, a different type of show. We lucked out because everybody's doing this now, Barry, so it doesn't look nearly as weird. But you know, we're seeing each other in ways and times and parts of the world that we never have ever seen each other before. And yet your hair still looks great. Thank you. I worked very hard. Hair and makeup started about six o'clock this morning. Oh really? No kidding. Bonnaroovian A, Barry Courter, Bonnaroovian B, Brad Steiner, Laura Taco joining as well. Look at, I'm taking in Barry's Oprah Lake set for those joining us on video. You can do that at whatpodcast.com. Your set has, you got some Amazon boxes, Barry, and some board games. Well, yeah, yeah. The Amazon boxes have, we were just talking about it, parts for putting ethernet cables together and the other one has a GoPro in it. Okay. So. Okay. I'm fascinated. I feel like I could just sit here and take a tour of your basement more often than actually talking about Bonnaroovian. What is that Bonnaroovian sign that you have right there? What is that? The, that on the floor? Yeah. That's the McCartney year. It's the poster. Really? Okay. Yeah. All right. Signed, no less. I just found that. By Paul McCartney? Yep. That's what I'm saying. Who signed it? I designed it. Oh, and look. Yay. Okay. It's signed by Greg McCartney. Yeah. Yeah. It doesn't really matter if it's not Paul. I love how you give me this impression that it's signed by Paul McCartney and then you say, Oh, I don't know who signed it. It could have been Dave. Some random man. What a great lineup though. Mumford, Tom Petty, Wilco. You know, I was thinking when, uh, when Bonnaroo officially cancels and not goes through this year, uh, I, it made me realize that I could start me. We should start a festival right now and then say that we are bringing every great band in the history of mankind together for a one show only one time only, and then eventually cancel because it's not going to happen anyway. It doesn't, it doesn't matter how good the Bonnaroo lineup is. It doesn't matter because it's not happening. Yeah. Oh man. We had them all. We had the stones, you too, Led Zeppelin and the Beatles all in one place, but it turns out we had to cancel. We were this close. So this close. Yeah. Yeah. I guess we can laugh about it. Is it too soon? The only thing you can do. Um, now, no, we don't have official word that Bonnaroo is canceled, but a lot of things to get canceled over the week, a hangout officially gone, uh, and, um, anything else, anything else from, or missing anything else? Oh, voodoo is officially canceled. Jazz Fest officially canceled. Didn't, uh, didn't Taylor Swift come out this week and say she's not touring till 2021? Yep. That's right. Um, that's big. Yeah. So it's not going to work. Whatever you try to do, it's not going to work. I'm being interrupted at the house. See, I don't have a fancy place for you guys to go like Barry in his basement taco and his, and his Volkswagen bus. I have to literally sit in the middle of the house. The only place I can get internet connection is right here in the middle of the house. Waaah. Like I'll show you, like this is, I'm literally at 360. This is what I got. I have to sit in the middle of the room to actually talk to you guys. You probably should have parked yourself in front of that window today. That would have been, if I just did this. Oh look, it's Ed O'Brien. Who knows who I am. It doesn't really matter. I had O'Brien. I got, I got really lucky. I talked to Ed O'Brien from Radiohead, uh, and his new album's out. So it's almost like a new music show today because, uh, uh, you guys got to talk to Rust and Wax. I hope that you brought up the new Fiona Apple album that I'm absolutely obsessed with. And then Ed O'Brien has a new album out too called Earth. Um, I had, I really like it. I don't know how it's doing as far as the reviews are, but my God, this Fiona Apple album is getting hundreds across the board. The Ed O'Brien project, uh, he was lucky. I don't know how in the world it happened, but I got to talk to Ed O'Brien literally in my living room. Um, now you guys are fun, but having a member of Radiohead hang out in my living room, even if he's cloaked in mystery, it was still one of the highlights of my life. Like the McCartney signature, we're going to say it's at O'Brien and you can't prove it otherwise. No, that was a great interview. You did a great job. And I mentioned it's weird because he's, he's sitting in front of a window and you can't really see him, but you know, it's him. And you know, I don't know if you have more guts than I do, but I'm not telling it O'Brien to, okay, can you adjust the lighting please? Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for calling, but yeah, no, it's really cool. Um, and we mentioned, um, it's kind of an unusual podcast week for us cause you talk to him, just you and then we'll rust. And I talked to, uh, Jesse and, uh, Melanie from rust and whack. So because of storms and power going out and life, uh, we're having to adapt. So, um, yeah, let's, I will be honest with you. Had we all been in the same city, I probably would just have canceled. Uh, this is just too much work. I'll, we'll just do it next month. Uh, so it's actually bright battered this way. Yeah, it's working out. We're adapting and thanks to all the people who keep listening and, uh, yeah. And in fact, some of the Patreons, you want to go through some of the Patreons while we, uh, while we have some time before we start our Ed O'Brien interview. Yeah, let's do it. Let me do it. And, and I like, we, I like what, uh, taco did. He broke it all down by the categories on this latest list. So kind of fun. The Mike Tyson group. Oh, I wonder how many of our listeners know why that's funny. Let's hope zero. I don't find it to be funny. I've got that. All of them. I can, we've got, we'll go to the audio later. All right. Under might we've got, uh, Aaron Carlson, Bill, we can find Bill's last name, David Grimes, Frank Swanson. His last name is McCartney. Joe McCartney, Frank Swanson, Liesl Condor, Phil Hanley, Timothy Proctor, Chloe Hammond. You may do the next group. No, we'll just stop right there and we'll go to that O'Brien interview. Uh, this was my chat with the EOB on the, uh, I guess the eve of his album release on the what podcast. All right. There we go. Uh, man, this is, uh, one of the great thrills of my life. I'll be totally honest with you. Um, not very often do I get to talk to a, uh, rock and roll hall of fame member and, uh, one of the greatest guitar players ever to live. Uh, so Mr. At O'Brien, thank you so much for, uh, all that you've done for, I mean, the world and, uh, especially music. It's a, it's an honor to talk to you. You are honestly, Brad, you are too kind. I've never, I, I, I don't actually walk around with those things in my head that you've just said. So this is how you and I are different. That's if I had them. Boy, I find you releasing an album right now with all the things that are happening around the world to be kind of apropos, you are a pretty thoughtful man. Um, and radio head has forever been a pretty thoughtful, thoughtful band. I don't guess that a global pandemic was thought of when you started putting together inspirations for an album and a tour, et cetera. No, it wasn't, but the record comes from a place. It's a, it's from, it's, it's a big hearted record. It comes, it comes from my heart. And one of the things, one of the themes in the record was I was trying to get to a place on parts of the record, that feeling of, of, of love and joy that when life is reduced to when it's, I had in my head when there's a crisis and I was really moved by this. And when for want of a word, better word, when the shit hits, hits the fan, I really wanted to get to that place where what music, how, how powerful music can be. Because for me in my life, and I'm sure everybody's life, that's a really important moment. And I wanted to get to that, that raw place. And what are the things that you feel? Well, love, love for your planet, love for your community, love for your family, your friends. And that's a genuine place I was trying to get to on this record. That was one of the themes. So it was, yeah, it's, it's weird how it's strange how things happen. And I was like, a friend of mine emailed me today and she said, and she's got, she's got breast cancer. And she said, I'm really loving Brazil, but I don't, can't hear the words. Can you write them out for me? I was like, this bad dream has got me, it's in you, it's in me, falling like I'm falling. I was like, oh my God, I can, you know, I can see how those words might resonate more at the moment in a funny kind of way. So that's, that's the funny thing about, you know, writing albums about things like love is that they last for a long time, even through pandemics and, you know, terror attacks and sort of horror to the world. It's what we come back to. And I always remember like, it really struck me like those, that awful, those awful stories about, you know, when 9-11 happened and that plane was going down and people on the plane were texting their loved ones and they were just saying, I love you. I love you. And they were knowing that they were about to die. And I still find that, I mean, I still get a spine tingle saying that that's, that's the human spirit. That's, you know, and so much of, this is the other thing. For me that, you know, when I was writing the life, when I was writing this album, we are bombarded in our media by how awful we want to are to one another, how destructive we are, and certainly that we do have a very destructive side. But I was interested in also focusing on that kind of love and the joy and the potential and the possibility of what we can do when we're a force for good and we come together. And you know, I really believe that. And we can see it happening. I can see it in our own country right now at eight o'clock tonight. Everybody stands on the steps in front by their door because we're an isolation. They go outside, stand by the door and they all clap. And everyone around the country is clapping at eight o'clock this evening for our health workers, our key workers. And do you know what? That's an amazing thing. That's such a beautiful moment. Why, yes, it's an interesting part of, you know, time. Time is really, really weird right now. But why now? Through all of it. I mean, 30 years with Radiohead, why was the time now for your first solo project? Do you know what? There's a part that I can literally say, which is the kind of the functional part, which goes, it was the first time in 2012, it was the first time I had some time to actually do this. You know, before my kids were born, my kids were born in 2004. And up until then, Radiohead had been pretty full on. I mean, Tom's first solo project, the Atoms for Peace, the Eraser came out in 2004. So that was the first time there was a possibility to do a solo project. But then I was fully immersed in fatherhood and being a hands on father. So there's that part. But also there's another part, which is you don't explain, and it's a bit like falling in love. You never know when you're going to fall in love. In fact, you almost always fall in love when you least expect it. If you're looking to fall in love, you know, you fall in love with all the wrong things. Yeah. But if you, when you truly fall in love, and to me, that's, that was, it's exactly the same, it's exactly the same moment as, you know, seeing my wife for the first time, which was really love at first sight. It's incredible. And this thing with the music was just like, suddenly it was here and it was just like, whoa, it was like, you know, it's like the tractor beam on the Death Star pulling you in, except it wasn't the Death Star. It was the Love and Light Star. Is that how, is that how, let me put it this way. When Radiohead goes to make an album, are they as a group thinking the same way as you are releasing this album in that the time will be right and the time will show you and when it's ready, this is when it's going to happen? It's very different because like, you know, Radiohead, you know, of course, Tom is the primary songwriter, but it is a five headed beast. You know, it's always been like that. So you know, we're all very different and that's been part of our strength and we all kind of push and pull in different ways. So it happens, I think with solo projects and I think that's one of the reasons that people like solo projects at first and much, there's a lot less friction. Do you know what I mean? Your point of view, your expression is manifested a lot quicker and a lot smoother in a solo project. Whereas in a band project, you know, it's obviously, you know, it's heightened. There's more input, but you know, it does come out at the end as a band and I think what's interesting in the early days as a band when you're together, so we're signed as a band at the end of 1991. We really don't stop until the summer of 1998 and then we have about two, three months off and then we go in to make Kid A, but we don't stop properly. We had a year off in 2004 and when you spend that much time together and you do have all these similar experiences together, you do start thinking the same way. Then what happens is that families happen and you know, you spend less and less time with the band because you've got this family that comes along and you want to spend and that's when you will go off and you have different experiences. When you come back together again, it's just, you're not as together as you once were. So I mean, I think that's one reason why, you know, in the last 10 years, Radiohead have only made two albums, it's a very natural thing. The idea that, and when Radiohead makes albums though, they don't just make albums. I mean, it's pretty remarkable that 30 years can go by and you guys will be the biggest deal of the year. That doesn't really happen with bands that are, you know, 30 years deep. I mean, that's the impact that Radiohead has had, but to get there, I got to imagine it takes a massively different headspace than to write a solo album that just came out of you when you finally had a moment, sounds like to yourself. How do you go from that headspace to the other? And I got to imagine it's like an actor almost trying to shake off a different character sometimes. Yeah, well, I mean, first of all, you should be aware that when, I don't think any of us are aware of, when you say like, when we release an album, it's an event, we don't actually think of it like that. So it feels kind of normal in one way, very normal and something we've been doing for a while. But how do you do it? How do you get into that headspace? I mean, the headspace for me in Radiohead has been for the best part of 25, 30 years, it's like a reflex. So it's very, very, it's very easy to fall back into. It's like a habit. It's like an old habit. With a new album, that was the thing that I had to find. And I had to kind of separate myself emotionally from Radiohead. I had to get over the fact that my, again, my reflex, my instinct was, what do the others think? And I realized after about two months, it's like, they're not even here. And do you know what? I don't, you know, I shouldn't be worrying what they think because if I do that, then I'm not fully expressing myself. And it was really, really important. I think that's the thing that I learned most of all. I had this mantra that, so halfway through the record, I come back from the last Radiohead tour in 2018, the summer, we'd done a North American tour, been fabulous. And I'd already worked on my album for four or five months. And I haven't listened to it for about eight weeks. I thought, come back to it. And we were going to do the final push in the studio. It was going to be mixed, you know, in October. And I listened to the songs. I was just like, oh my God, this is shit. What the hell have I been doing? Oh no. And it was a brilliant moment because it is those moments, and I'm sure you and your listeners recognize this. Sometimes in your life, a crisis can be an amazing, it's like the dark night of the soul. It's the thing when you truly, fully awaken and you awaken to a truth or a self revelation or whatever, you realize something. And I woke to the fact that it's like, I was just like, I haven't been truthful about how I really feel. And for me, the mantra became, so what is my truth? And daily it became a really important thing in the studio, it's like, what is my truth? What am I really feeling here? What, you know, I'm working with great people. I've got Floods and Catherine Martz, these incredible engineers and producers, but ultimately it has to come down to what I feel. And so that's the thing that I had to learn. And because that's not a place that I've naturally inhabited, that's not a place that I've been fully comfortable with. It sounds like a tad bit of vulnerability. Oh yeah, man. I mean, it's, you know, I think that's what I've loved about this whole process is I've been supremely out of my comfort zone, you know, and it is a vulnerable place. And but you see, you know, I heard a great quote the other day that kind of sums it up about art. It says, art is not about perfection. Art is about the truth. Now that's not saying that is the truth. That's a truth, the truth of the creator. And that's what you have to get. You have to, and I think in order to get to that point, you have to be vulnerable. You have to be, stuff happens and you have to be out of your comfort zone. That's Bowie said that. Bowie said that's the only place you've got to be. And I, you know, I think that's been the case with Radiohead, you know, different records we made. It's been a constant out of your comfort zone. And that's not a natural place for human being to want to reside in, but it's really good for creativity. I bet. And when you got there in 2018 and you looked and heard the things that you had your reaction to, what did you do with them? How many of them actually made it to the album? Did you scrap it all? No, they all made it. So what I did was I went through each song and they were layer upon layer. And I had like five different versions of each song. And I started with the demo, the very first thing, and I was just like, okay, I'm feeling it here. I'm not feeling it that version, that version. And literally, whatever I felt, whatever I felt, you know, whether I was getting an emotional kind of musical response, then that's where I started. And it was amazing. Once I followed that path, we got into this incredible, you know, Shangri-La was the first day back. It was basically finished within two days. And it was sounding like a kind of, I don't know, a sonic nightmare. And it was like cleaning out like boom, boom, boom, it's got to do this. And it's amazing. Once you get to that place, things fall into place as well. I wonder when you, that is so fascinating that you said that it's about the truth because that it was the truth that was real to you at the time. And then you sort of figured out where the songs needed to be. I wonder if you go back, maybe not back, you'll forward in two years and see the songs again, how they would change if you were to rewrite them based on the truth you were feeling at that moment. Oh, yeah. Well, the truth, of course, constantly changes. You know, the truth one year is, you know, so for me, it's been interesting because I've had these songs finished for a year and I then had to find a record company and the right people to work with. And now it's on release. There's this very interesting sign of creative thing that happens. I was so happy with it when I finished. I'm really happy with it. It's just like I fulfilled the potential of the songs. And now I'm like going, oh, I, yeah, I've do it a bit differently now. And that is something I recognize from Radiohead. It's like, you know, even when OK Computer comes out, you go like, ah, yeah, it's good, but we can do better. Same thing with Kid A. It's just like, ah, you know what, we need something a bit more alive. Make Hell to the Thief. Ah, and Rainbows comes out. It's like, we really need to make a record that's like as good as the Benz and OK Computer. And that's the artistic way. So the thing is to be truthful to how you feel at the time, because it would be an impossibility to say this is the truth. Sure. It's just a moment. I tell you, I couldn't be more excited about this project. I think Shangri-La is fantastic. I don't know where it fell in the whole songwriting process. When it first, last, it doesn't matter. It's a great song. I think I was, my interest was piqued when I heard EOB and Ed O'Brien was releasing an album. Then I heard the reviews that came out of your first Chicago show. And the way that people were reacting to the live show, I think is what put me over the edge excited about this project. When you write something like you did with this album, how often are you putting in the live feel for it? When you write something, are you thinking about how it's going to transcribe on stage, whether it's at the Metro in Chicago or the House of Blues in New Orleans or Bonnaroo when you play in the fall? It's interesting with some songs I get. So, for instance, on songs like Olympic and Shangri-La and Brazil, when it's in focus, when it's really working in the studio, there are moments when you think about, you know, you feel it in front of an audience and you go, yeah, and you're not making it for the audience. But I've always liked albums. One of the things, and I felt it was kind of important because the live thing is really important to me. It's that direct connection with the audience. I love albums where you get, it's almost you hear it and you go, oh, I've got to go and see that live. It's like an invitation. So for instance, I really love the Foles records, Holy Fire, and I think they make a lot of great records. But that record for me was up when I first, that was my kind of introduction to Foles. I was a bit late, but I was like, oh my God, that first song, Prelude, I was just like, this is going to open a gig. And sure enough, it was like an invitation to, you know, it's going to be an emotional, energetic, vibrant, vital show. So yeah, I'm kind of aware. I don't think you make music necessarily for live, but definitely on this record, I was just like, I want this to feel like an invitation to come and be together. And so, but first off, I mean, finally, not first off, but as we close, I can't thank you enough. I'm so excited for this project. I can't believe I've got Ed O'Brien in my living room. This is very, very strange. I'm not going to lie to you. But yeah, I mean it when I say it. There's a few people in modern music right now that you can honestly say changed the course of modern music. And you guys, you're five of them. So to have one of them talk to us is, I mean, I can't thank you enough and I can't tell you how excited I am to finally see this show, Bonnaroo. Thanks, Fred. I'm a huge music festival fan, so a guy like you, you could be one of the greatest guitar players to ever exist. But yet on the farm, there's so many, Bonnaroo, there's 15 other things to watch at one time. I mean, we tragically just lost John Prine a couple of days ago. And there might have been 1,200 people at that show, at the John Prine show. I am imploring anybody and everyone, if this world gets back to normal and there is a live performance happening in the fall of any kind, please see the COB show. I'm very, very excited about seeing this live show. So yeah, by the way, are you bringing in the people that you worked with, with you on the road? No, but I have to say, we have a native of New Orleans. My drummer, my friend, Alvin Ford Jr., who's an extraordinary drummer, an extraordinary person. And if any of your listeners know Alvin, tell him I miss him and I love him and I hope he's all right in the family. I sent him a text today, so I hope he's all right. But listen, Brad, thank you. I mean, when you say stuff like that, I need to speak to this guy when my kids are shouting him about what a lousy father I am. I'm like, I should get you on the phone and pass you over and say, hey guys, listen to Brad. You can use whatever I say on your resume. Thank you, Brad. I hope you stay safe and well and big love to all your listeners and I hope they all come together and I hope it all works out. You as well. And we're glad that you're feeling better. Thanks man. Thank you. Good luck. Thanks. Bye. Bye. Possible could be he might be appearing at Bonnaroo 2020 and most likely Bonnaroo 2021. Ed O'Brien on the What Podcasts? Barry Courter. I'm Brad Steiner. There's Lord Taco. I don't know if he's going to be one of those that last for 2021 if everything gets canceled. My bet is, you know, you have Ed O'Brien-ish artists not making it to the next year. In his case, I have a feeling like there's going to be another Radiohead project or a Radiohead tour. This was the only I sort of feel bad for him because this is probably the only shot that he had to sort of make this album a thing. This was the time that he had and then look what all happened. Global pandemic that keeps him off the road and pushes everything to 2021 and who knows if there's anything around in 2021 for him to do. Yeah, I mean, you kind of gather that and it was interesting hearing him talk about how a project like that comes up and why doesn't it come up last year and the year before, you know, how it just sort of things have to fall into place. And yeah, that's an interesting topic. I like talking to artists about things like that. You'll see an artist go 10 years between projects and you know, it's a hindsight thing. I don't think 10 years ago they said, I'm going to wait 10 years. It's just life happens and then all of a sudden things fall into place. But it was interesting to hear him talk about blowing it up basically or almost blowing it all up because he, you know, went back to it and thought it wasn't good enough. There's a lot of good stuff in that interview. Well, that's the great thing about being, oh, I don't know, in a band like Radiohead is that you can pretty much do whatever you want whenever you want. You know, you get some time, you know, you write an album, you think some of these songs stink. You go on a tour with Radiohead and you know, you get some more time and then we all come back to it. It's a nice little fallback plan, you know, having Radiohead in your back pocket ain't going to hurt. Yeah, but it's fun to hear him talk about, he didn't say it that way, but sort of the pressure of, you know, how will his work rise to the level of what a Radiohead does? You know, you ask him about when those albums come out, they're worldwide events and he said they don't even think about it that way. That's pretty, yeah, I know, right? It's kind of a big deal. Yeah, I mean, you know, you too put every song that they put on an album on my phone and forced me to listen to it every time I turned it on. They understand the gravity of it. I don't really take him seriously when he says that. He's just being humble. He's being humble, but that you too is a good example. That was a mistake. They, you know, thought there that was a cool thing and it kind of backfired on them. So, yeah, well, let's go through some more Patreons before we get into Rust and Wax. I'm actually excited to hear you guys chat with him because I look, we're all sort of impacted by this, but a local record store that, you know, really, really, really relies on people walking in the door and experiencing holding a piece of vinyl and searching through the new stuff is, they've got to be hurting right now. They've got to be in a tough spot. There's only so many online orders that you can take to sort of, you know, supplement the things that you're losing on a regular basis, right? Yeah, they do okay, but you said it exactly right. That's what's interesting about these record stores opening now is that they have again become places to hang out, the community, and they talk about the fact that it's a lot of the local musicians and musicians that are coming to town to West Palm Beach where they are that gives them a lot of support. And we have a local guy who's trying to open one here. And when I interviewed him, that was the thing that he talked about was it becoming this hangout place, not just a place to sell vinyl, but a place for bands to put up, you know, flyers and to meet people and do small shows and for fans to swap ideas and stories. Look, yeah, I'll give you a million dollar business idea. If you want to open a record shop, put a bar in there because there's nothing I like more than playing vinyl and drinking beer. So if you want to make it a hangout, you know, serve 10 craft beers on tap. That's pretty much it. Community outside of Chattanooga here, they have a record store and they do that. They bring a keg in, I think every Friday afternoon and just sort of hang out. There's a place in Portland, Oregon that I fell in love with. It was literally a record shop and beer spot. They make craft cocktails, support craft beer. And you could sit there in your independent little sections and listen to the vinyl that you wanted to buy and sit there in cocktails. It was brilliant. They were like this giant couches everywhere. They had little record stations. You put your headphones on and listen to the vinyl. You then turn around and buy the vinyl and, you know, have three beers. Brilliant. I'd be there every day. I love everything about that. It was an interesting conversation with them. All right, let's go through some Patreons and then we'll listen to the interview. All right. Bring back the Arch. Dan Sweeney, Dustin Gehrig, Haley, Mary T, Melanie and Jesse Feldman, the Rust and Wax folks, Mitchell Stafford, Musical Antlers, Parker Reed, Skyler Torey. And seeing Parker's name reminds me, he asked us and we should tell everybody, yes, we are still putting the mixtapes together and the gift packs and we'll have to get those out. We just do you got I mean, do we do it now like we thought or do we wait till closer and kind of get everybody ramped up again or? You know, they're going to happen no matter what. I mean, yeah, they're not going to. Yeah, we're not going to we're not going to ditch him just because the festival cancels. But you know, I feel like just holding out until we actually hear it being canceled is probably the the way to go. You know, there's still a there's still a shot. There's still a chance that it happens. And on the off chance that it does, let's still crossing fingers and holding out hope. Who's your friend there, Brad? This is Popeye. Look at Popeye. I was just staring at him and he was sitting there watching me do the podcast and I felt bad. I didn't get to bring him in. Yeah. Anybody else who need to talk about this? Well, you want to go through another? We got three more Patreon groups. The Glazed Group, Chelsea Davis, Evan Brown, Gordon Silver, Jason Hazelbaker, Joshua Herndon, Lauren Edholm, Linda Doles, Lucy Young, Nick Eatman, Ross McNamara, Ryan Mathewson, Sean McCarthy, Tyrone Basket, William Richards and Clay Wilhoit. You know, I'm sort of offended. The two Patreon levels that were named after people, Mike Tyson and Glazed, Glazed being named after our friends of Repeat Repeat. Neither Mike Tyson nor the Repeat Repeat family have donated to the Patreons. I'm a little offended by that. Yeah, Tyson. Maybe it's a confusion thing. Wrong guy. Maybe it's the wrong guy. Maybe that Mr. T, has he contributed? I don't see him either. You know, I don't know if he's available. He may not. That check might not clear. Let's go to the Russ and Wax interview. Anything before we go into this? This is exciting. I like these guys. Yeah, no, I can't think of anything. Taco, you were there. It was a good interview. It was fun. It was. Yeah, it was a neat topic and a neat chat to talk with them about what they're doing. And Russ has even bought some stuff from Russ and Wax. He bought a record. Yeah, they did some. We did a promo. We did a product placement and everything. All right. Here we go. On what podcast? We're with Jesse and Melanie Feldman, right? From West Palm Beach. You guys are the owners of Russ and Wax, the record store down there. Is that right? That's correct. Got it. All right. All right. I was saying earlier, Brad is not on with us. This is going to be kind of a weird episode. Unplanned, but really, really cool. Later, he's got an interview with Ed O'Brien, EOB, who is scheduled to be there. That's for anybody who possibly doesn't know, is Radiohead, the guitar player. And he's got a solo album out and Brad's got a great interview with him. But they had some power issues. So his wife is using the computer all day today for Zoom. And we had this set up. So we're going to be talking to you. So point me in, it'll be just me with you guys and then just him with Ed and Taco, of course. Just along for the ride. Just along. Yeah. In the bus. Yeah. Thanks for doing this. I'm excited about it for several reasons. One, you guys are Bonnaroo fans, obviously. But the whole record store thing is really kind of a cool topic to me as a music fan and a newspaper guy. So we're going to jump all over the place if that's all right with you guys. Works with us. Thanks for having us. How long have you been going to Bonnaroo? We started in 2017. So this is supposed to be our fourth year. Yeah. Yeah. She had been pounding me to go for a few years and finally broke me down the year when Chili Peppers were playing and U2 was doing Joshua Tree and Car Seat Headrest was there and a bunch of other people. So I had to go. Do you go to other festivals? We haven't been to so many other ones recently. But yeah, we kind of started with Mumford and Sons put on their Gentleman of the Road tour and they were in St. Augustine, which is like a few hours from us. That was kind of our intro to the festival world. It wasn't a camping festival. But once we went to that, that was kind of the moment. You were like, all right, we're in. Like two years after that, I think we went to one out in Colorado. Same thing, Gentleman of the Road. And then we went to the first year of Okeechobee down here, which is like an hour from our house. And then the year after that, we finally broke down and went to Bonnaroo. And it's been no looking back since then. It's different, isn't it? It's different than the other ones. And I mean, you know, I've been to Lollapalooza in Chicago and I've been to other music festivals over the years, and it really is. It's not just the line. I keep hearing everyone say, you know, it doesn't matter what the lineup is. You just go. And I couldn't agree more. It's the culture and then everything else just kind of falls into place. What was it about that first one, Melanie, especially that I mean, you guys are obviously music fans. You've got a record store. So, well, Mumford and Sons is one of my all time favorites. And it was something about just like being surrounded by a bunch of other people who were there for the music and just wanted to have a good time. And it was just one of those like you could let go moments and nobody cares about anything. Yeah, it was like a release, you know, it's almost like it's like camp for like grownups and grownups. It's the best time and it's like a combination of grownup camp and just mental therapy every year. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. And for me, there's a difference between sitting at home in my basement listening to music and being there. Yeah. And I mean, and that sounds like an obvious thing to say, but just the fact that you're there with other people and you have so many choices and the discovery option, I think to me is a big, big part of it. You know, it's like you paid your ticket. There's 10 bands that are playing today you've never heard of. Why not give them a chance? You know? Yeah. Yeah. You always mentioned the drive bys. The drive bys are some of the best parts of the festival when you get in an hour earlier than you expected because the line wasn't as long that particular moment. You're like, all right, we got an hour to kill. Let's go see whoever it is. And then suddenly you've got a new band that you're obsessed with. It's the best. Yeah, absolutely. There's a bunch of those for me. And that's if I, if I come home and have a new favorite, it's been a really good festival. It's always been a good festival, but that, that sort of bumps it up. Some are big and some are small. Like my morning jacket, I was completely unaware of until, and then I became obsessed. The Bahamas I always talk about. I mean, that's like today in the morning. That's a good way to start the day always for me. And I had no idea who, you know, who they were, to be honest. So how long have you had the record store? We started, we have our, we've had our physical location for about two and a half years, give or take. And we've been doing prior to that kind of pop-up events, going to like local bars and indie markets and stuff like that. And just kind of popping up with a few crates of records and selling them and stuff. But for the most part, yeah, I mean, our shop's been located in West Palm now for a little over like right around two and a half years. I don't know if I've ever talked about this, but one of my first jobs in high school was at the record bar at the mall here and it was sort of the tail end of those. They were still really, really cool. Right. You know what I mean? That's where everybody went to hang out. That's where you found your new music. Eight tracks were still a thing. I remember taking them off the shelves as they quit being a thing and CD started. And then my older brother owned a record shop similar to yours for a long time. And one of the guys that I've interviewed, a musician here, is talking about opening one. And it was interesting because it wasn't about selling vinyl and it being sort of trendy. It was more about the communal space that they've become again. Is that what you guys are finding? Yeah, I mean, you know, our shop, it's kind of in a unique setup. So our shop is in currently right now we're in a bigger warehouse space called Elizabeth Ab station, which is a live music venue and there's a couple other vendors and there's a bar and a coffee shop and all that stuff. So what we've really noticed is some of our like most consistent customers are the local musicians in the community and they come in and they hang out and you know, it's kind of cool like now we've been supporting them and they've been supporting us throughout the shutdown, like us promoting their online pop up concerts and then sending people to our shop for our online drops. But yeah, I mean, the community aspect of it has been great and even just the local vinyl community, you know, we live kind of in an area where before we popped up, there wasn't a record shop within an hour's drive. And once we filled that hole, you start realizing, oh, there's a lot of people in this area that have been like thirsty for a place where they can kind of congregate and spend an hour or two digging for records. Yeah, that's the thing. Digging through them and talking about them and holding them. Yeah, I mean, people, all the stories talk about vinyl. I mean, I remember sitting down, playing it, looking at the album cover and reading who is on it and memorizing who was on it and swapping that information with friends, you know, who knew more, you know, how deep could you go? Who was the engineer? You know, all that kind of nerd stuff. But even just trying to find like the little Easter eggs that the artists leave in the sleeve like I still remember I would stare at the Green Day Dookie poster when I was a kid, add that on my wall and I would look at that and look at the album and try to figure out like what little things did they leave for the true fans to find inside of the jacket? I mean, that was the best. Yeah. And also using the spaces like you're talking about to share who's playing where, you know, the things that we've all missed, plug in headphones in, you know, with MP3s all these years. And the other the cool thing is it's a lot of new vinyl, right? I mean, you're not that was for a long time. It was just sort of reselling old classics. But now I think the numbers are showing that new vinyl is on the up sale, or at least it was six weeks ago. Yeah, I mean, it still kind of is. I mean, there's a I think it's in the last, what, six or seven years, a lot of plants have come online, brand new pressing plants. They've been either with new equipment or they've been tracking down the old equipment that's been sitting in basements of factories wherever they've been and opening up shop and pressing vinyl. I mean, we just watched a documentary on it last night basically about the resurgence of it and how many plants were coming online because there was so much lag time for the smaller acts to get their titles pressed. But yeah, I mean, our shop right now is what about a third new press? Yeah, we're about one third new and two thirds used. Yeah, but yeah, I mean, pretty much like any of any new record that's coming out, it's coming out on vinyl and people that's the format that they want. Yeah. Yeah. All right, quick poll. Sounds better. Yes or no. And there's only one right answer. Like we just had this discussion. We just had this discussion. The answer is it depends. There's so many factors that go into it. You know, who who was producing the album, who was mastering the album, how was it mastered, what kind of record is it on? You know, is it on one hundred and eighty gram? Is it on the cheap flimsy stuff that was made in the 80s when you had the oil shortage? Like how was it made? What kind of turntable are you playing it on? Are you playing on a forty dollar turntable or a ten thousand dollar turntable? But I mean, for us, what we what we landed on was it's the experience that's better because you're when you've opened up an album and drop it on that turntable and you drop the needle, you're committing to that album. You're not just pulling up one song in your cat, you know, in your catalog of fifteen thousand songs on your phone. You're committing to listen to one album front to back. And the art, you know, going back to our first Bonnaroo, there's an art, you know, there's artists that pay very close attention to when they're putting an album together, how they end side A and start side B, how they track list the exact order that it comes in, the you know, how they put the jacket together, what they put into that with liner notes. There's so much that goes into it that creates the experience of sitting down and really just absorbing a record as opposed to putting something on in the background, streaming it and connecting it to a couple of speakers in your house and walking around and vacuuming the floor while you're listening. Taco sound better, yes or no? I think so, at least in my own mind, you know. But yeah, I think I also think it's the ritual. It's you know, you can pick up your phone and press play with one one tap of your finger. But you know, actually get it out of the sleeve and lay it on the turntable, clean it, you know, the whole set up just, you know, it feels a lot more dedicated to. That's what you're going to, you know, enjoy. It's an event. It's definitely an event. Yeah. The answer is yes, it sounds better. All other things being, you're right. If it's on a cheap turntable and you know, bad speakers. But like I have a former coworker who owned a record store. He jokes that he basically he bought it and was printing money for about six months and then CDs came out and it just it just killed him. But I was stunned. I borrowed his hard drive a couple of years ago to get all of his songs off of it. And he would pick cherry pick one or two songs off of, you know, classic albums and only put the to this day. I don't understand that it would I would, you know, scroll down and be like, oh, good. He's got ACDC or an old Led Zeppelin and it'd be two songs. Mike, who does that? But even on that same note, like there's certain artists that we both appreciated back in the day but never truly found ourselves loving until we sat down with them and listened to them on vinyl for the first time front to back. You know, I liked Pink Floyd. I know it's crazy to think that I'm not going to say that I loved Pink Floyd my entire life, but I liked them. If they were on the radio, you would hear the two or three songs that they always put on the radio. But the first time you listen to Dark Side front to back on a good sound system, it kicks you in the face in a way that you've never been kicked before. Yeah, something about that. I had headphones. I remember when that thing came out, we were obsessed with it at school, finding the Easter eggs like you said, you know, trying to figure out what was going on and the oomphs and all the little things. Man, I listened to that one. I actually made a cassette tape of that and with every drive into work that would I would listen to that and Sandinista, the clash, obsessed with both of those. So yeah, once you sort of listen front to back and understand that it was put together with a purpose, it becomes a whole nother thing, doesn't it? Yeah, it really does. You realize that they put the album together with a very specific intention and purpose. You know, it's kind of like when a band puts together a set list for their shows, you know, you can tell the ones that just threw it together haphazardly and knew exactly what they were doing and how they were leading one song into the next. That's a great point. And that's why I think that childish Gambino show last year and Andy Brandy Carlisle were both so amazing. I mean, there was not a there was not an out of place second in that Gambino show, right? Yeah. So we have a sad Gambino. I am a huge Courtney Barnett fan. Yes, both of us. Yeah, we both. And so she was conflicting, unfortunately, with the beginning. There was like a 10 minute overlap. Right. So we're like, we made the decision we were going to commit to Courtney and then and we're both childish Gambino fans. So we wanted to be there for sure. But by the time we got over there, that crowd, I that was the biggest crowd I've ever seen ever at a Bonnaroo show. And I'm five foot six. She's five foot nothing. And I swear that every single person that was in that field that day was seven foot two. And we could not lie. We tried all the tricks. We went to the side with the bees. You know, we went to the side with the bees. We tried. We couldn't find any line of sight that works. But from what I've heard from everyone, the way it's been described to me, it was like Childish was on a set of train tracks and every move he made throughout that entire stage was so perfectly choreographed. Every word he spoke, every breath he exhaled, it was like I mean, the dude is a scientist when it comes to music. Like he's very, very skilled. Yeah, it was it was absolutely that. But that's what happens. You know, you try to make those choices. It hurts. Brandy Carlisle was one that actually blew us away. We didn't even intend to be at that set. That's one of those drive bys. We were just, you know, having one of those like exhausted moments and we're like, let's just pop up chairs at the back of the what field and just like check it out. And we were both like having like a moment. Like there were tears. Yeah. This is just the most beautiful thing we've ever seen. I don't know why I was crying, but I was just like, I just need to be alone first. Second year. Well, her stories. I mean, Father's Day and you know, we're talking about her children and her wife. And yeah, I mean, Brad says it all the time. We were up front and I can remember turning around and looking and just boohooing and we all were. And that was pretty true. I had forgotten. I didn't I didn't mean to go to the Gambino show. I somehow just the opposite. I thought, well, I'll wander through the back area to see how close I can get. And ended up right on the rail. I know, right? Wow. That just was like, wow, the whole time. I pulled Brad there. Yeah, it was. But it was amazing from coming out and opening out in the audience to just every single moment being so well choreographed. What what's sort of what's new that you guys have gotten in that? I mean, we were talking earlier, you and Brad, I guess we're online talking about the new Fiona Apple that just came out and Ed O'Brien's album is out. And Brad will actually have an interview with him on this show. It's like we planned it, you know, what we were doing. We never do. Never do. What else is good? Oh, man, I can't stop recommending it to enough people. The new Thundercat album is one of the best things I've heard in a very long time. Since it came out, what, two or three weeks ago, we've probably we've probably played it like 100 times. It's really, really good. And Childish Gambino is on one of the songs. Kamasi Washington is on one. It's just that's another one of those artists that I feel like is really starting to kind of come into his own. And I, you know, we caught maybe two songs that he said a few years ago, sort of a drive by discovery at Bonnaroo. And yeah, but that album's been great. The new Strokes album is really good. You know, they've been gone for I think eight years and they came back with their new album two weeks ago. That album has been a great album. And yeah, the Ed O'Brien came out last week. We've had a lot of people asking for that as well. Yeah, it's really good. Crangben and Leon Bridges EP, Texas Sun. That album. Yeah, that was fantastic. And we've had that. That's been a big seller. Yeah, we can't keep that in stock. And they can't produce them fast enough. They can't even get them in. They've been like back ordered forever. So yeah, you actually bought something from them. I did. Yeah, you guys have been doing, you know, online record drops and I've been watching and there was one I just, you know, couldn't live without. So yeah, yeah, with me. Yeah, I've been loving it. So really appreciate it. And thank you. We saw Russ with the bus. I'm like, is this Lord Taco? We definitely geeked out for a moment. Well, thanks. I was geeking out too. Who is on your? Yeah. That causes a lot of people to geek out. Who is on your list to see? And I don't, I'm not asking as, you know, as a whiny, I mean, we all know what's happened and it's happened for the right reason. But it was such a stellar, it is such a stellar lineup. Who are you guys looking forward to seeing live? I mean, we had a lot this year that we were really excited about. For me, I would say that Sylvanasso with show. Yes. I mean, when they announced that tour last year and they weren't coming anywhere near Florida, I was just like depressed. And when I saw that lineup, I saw that on the lineup. I mean, like that was just the moment for me. I was like, oh yeah, I'm done. You know, that's it. If I go to one show, that'll be the one. So that that kind of bums me out. Yeah. But that, I mean, Brittany Howard, we were like obsessed with that album when it came out last year. She still holds a grudge against me because I got to see Alabama Shakes at Voodoo Fest a few years back and she, I was on a bachelor party and I was sending her a video from there and she's like, I just don't want to talk to you anytime soon. Kind of mean. I have not seen the Shakes in any form. And yeah, so Brittany Howard was a big one for us. Vampire Weekend. Vampire Weekend we love. Yeah. There were so many. Yeah. I mean, I was excited for King Gizzard and Run the Jewels. There were a lot of artists that we started discovering that were on that Thursday lineup. I mean, we already started our deep dive into the lineup. So we were we were getting hooked on a lot of people that we didn't even know. Devon Gilfillian was one. What was the other kid's name? Yeah. There was another Thursday one that we were just super into. We actually got a chance to see Bristol Moroni. Yeah. Bristol Moroni. Yeah. Yeah. We were. Yeah. Bristol. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Of all things. Yeah. We recently got into Wallows. Yeah. And we got actually lucky enough to get a chance to see them down in South Florida about a month or two ago, like just before everything kind of stopped. Got crazy. And we weren't going to go to the show because it was like a Tuesday night. And we're like, I will see them at Bonnaroo. But then something we were just like, you know what, let's just go. And I'm so glad we did because it was a great show and we may not see. We may not see any other shows. Well, you guys can answer this because we talk about it a lot. Do you go to everything together or do you go separate ways or how does that work? We pretty much stick together. I mean, we have, I would say like what, like 85, 90% of our taste is overlapping. And then there's like those couple of shows where he's super excited and I don't really care, but I'll go along and vice versa. And some of those, I'm really excited and I bring her along and she falls in love with the band. Like last year, the national and Jim James, I am a massive national fan, a massive Jim James fan. She wasn't. And I think I can honestly say that that changed. Like there was one point during the Jim James show where she was just staring at the stage mesmerized by Jim with his sleeveless shirt and his hair flowing in the wind. We had seen my morning jacket years ago down here and it was kind of a sleepy set. And I was just like, eh, like I get it. Like super talented, but like it just wasn't necessarily my cup of tea. And then he dragged me to that show and we were on the rail and it was just incredible. He's mesmerizing. Yeah. Like literally like that's the word. Just mesmerizing. Yeah. I mean, Dryad will tell. We went to forecastle, what, four or five years ago when it was sort of a reunion show for them and he admitted later that he wasn't that big a fan and was just going because of me and, and really, really liked it. So yeah, I'm obsessed with them. That's one of the few bands that I will put on and play. Just repeat, just keep same song. I don't care. Over and over. There aren't many of them, but they're one of them. Yeah. You talked, I think we talked about whether or not September is going to happen or not. It's starting to feel kind of weird, isn't it? Yeah. We, yeah, we kind of keep like having that conversation of like, it's probably not going to happen, but we're going to be optimistic and see, you know, obviously we get it, you know, whatever. But, you know, even just kind of some of the rumblings within like the industry of, you know, other artists canceling things further out than that is not really a great sign. I think throughout this whole process, you've seen institutions that are big name institutions signaling to the rest of the world that it's okay to shut down. Like before everyone shut down, you had Harvard shutting things down. You know, you had certain music, you had Coachella shutting things down and then South By and then as soon as they did that, everyone else just fell like dominoes. And I think, I think it was yesterday or the day before Taylor Swift came out and said everything through 2020 is shut down for her. And when she did that, I think that that was her basically signal signaling to the labels in the music festivals and everything that it's okay to shut it down. Yeah. No, that's going to be heard by everybody. But I honestly, I think it's going to be hard for music festivals like Bonnaroo and others to get insurance policies to cover what they need. I think it's going to be hard for them logistically to get brands to sign on, especially when the news broadcasts are going to be like they've been down here, unfortunately in Florida when spring breakers were running around and all you saw was, you know, that city's name being plastered over and over again about being the bad place to be. You know, you're not going to want to see your brand in the background of those bad news stories. And I think I don't like saying those words into the universe. No, I totally, I totally agree. I think there are so many layers to it that not everyone is considering, you know, will there be sponsorship money? Does the brand guys want to be that? Will the insurance even allow it? And then on down, you know, Live Nation just what, last week their big bosses are taking pay cuts and they're huge. I mean, think of everything they control. And then I was talking to one of the local venue bookers, the guy who books the shows and he's now having negotiations with trying to move shows and work out payments, you know, because the bands are starving, they're hungry, they want to work. So they're asking a crazy amount of money. And he's like, well, I'm not sure I can even get half a crowd in there legally. So I can't recoup what you're asking for. You know what I mean? There's all these details that are that the truth of the matter is nobody knows the answer, right now. Yeah, I think that's yeah, I think that's the hard part for people to is like, it's hard to digest it when you you don't even know what like what next week will look like. So I mean, yeah, we had tornadoes hit here. Excuse me. I was just saying it's like when you you know, a tornado hits, you kind of know the process of what you have to do to get back. Yeah, normal. This one, there's nothing, you know, you can put it on a piece of paper. All you want, but because we're used to hurricanes down here. And it's like, you know, you have that anticipation and the preparation phase. And usually we know like, you know, seven to 10 days out and we're getting ready and then it happens. And then, you know, you move past it. But there's just like, you know, so yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, what else? Anything that I didn't ask about that you wanted to talk about or hoping I'd ask about? Yeah. Oh, yeah, no, we're just really hoping this was going to be our first year doing VIP. Yeah. Yeah, I was going to ask how you guys do you travel with other people and how do you how do you do it? So we we've been going we did two years. I don't know. We did one year by ourselves. Just the two of us. And then first year was just the two of us. We don't really have a lot of friends that are into this kind of thing. All of our friends are having kids and doing all that stuff. And we're just going to music festivals, spending all of our money on concerts and records. Yeah. But yeah, we've been the last year and the year before we did join group camping. Yeah. And we met a couple of friends, people. So we've been camping with them and we were going to try to coordinate with them this year. And then I kind of thought that it was a sellout year and I was like, it's going to be a little crowded. Maybe we should try VIP. We were we usually do like try to do like a big vacation every year. And this year we weren't really sure we were going to get to do that. So we kind of figured this will go all out. Very cool. Yeah. Ross, you got anything? I think that about covers that you want to plug your record shop and where can people find you and if they need some records? Yeah, man, at least for the foreseeable future while the quarantine is going on down in Florida and wherever else, we're doing record drops on our Instagram page. It's at Rust R.U.S.T. and WAX. And we've just been every Thursday night, we've been at eight o'clock posting a live video stream of whatever records we're releasing into the world that day and then having people DM us directly, letting us know exactly what they want. And it's kind of a first come first serve basis. And then if you're local in the West Palm area, we've been meeting you to hand deliver the records to you. Or if you are like Russ and you need records, your green bus, we go and we ship them out. And we've been shipping all over the United States and we got a record going to Puerto Rico on Monday and some others actually heading up to Tennessee and Georgia. So yeah, you know, if you're looking to buy some records at Rust and WAX and we'd really appreciate the support and also support if you have local record stores, support your local record stores. They need it right now. And in bars, restaurants, whatever you can support locally, it is every single sale is greatly appreciated. And if you have a local musician or artist that you are obsessed with, they want to see on the other side of this, stream their music, buy some merch from them or just ask them what their Venmo is and shoot them a couple of bucks. They need it right now. Yeah, we've had several groups doing that up here. Some of the bars are opening up for one to week or they're just doing from their house. And that's pretty cool. And people have been supportive. Yeah, that's a good message. Yeah, it's Rust and WAX. Is it with an ampersand or spelled out? A and D spelled out. Yeah. All right. Very cool. Well, thank you guys so much. I look forward to you guys meeting you in person. Yeah, for sure. Hopefully. See you see you see somebody else. I understand. Yeah. Thanks so much. Thanks for being Patreon supporters too. Appreciate it. Yeah, love it. Thank you guys for having that available. All right, guys. Take care. Thank you. Thank you. Boozing already, Barry. That's water. Oh, I sure it is. Not even me. That's a little strong for me. Rust and WAX, EOB. That's Barry Courter and Brad Steiner, Floor Taco on the What Podcast. Anything else we need to do before we say goodbye today? Got two more Patreon groups. Okay. Marty McFly. Those guys. Thank you all. David Bride, Catherine Riccio, David Solano, Jacob Marty, Justin Nigro. I hope I'm saying that right. I have no confidence that you are. Yeah. And the high five group, Brooke Tussie, Daniel and Sharla, the folks down at the Real Roobus, David Henson, Ella, Phil Nye, and Sean McCain. Thanks to all those guys. And thank you for joining us on the What Podcast. We'll talk to you hopefully next week with everything, oh, Larkin Po next week. You want to do Larkin Po next week? Yeah, let's do Larkin Po. Cool. No, more artists that probably will not be at Bonnaroo in 2020. But who knows? We'll see what happens next week on the What Podcast. Do good music. Yeah, gotcha. Hey, hey, hey, hey. How y'all feeling? Journey through the stories that define the artists playing Bonnaroo. Who are they? What are they? What will you see? The what? Which bands? The what? The what? The what? The what? What? The what? The what?