Durand Jones and The Indications singer/songwriter/musician Aaron Frazer tells Brad and Barry of The What Podcast that working with the band and releasing his own solo album is sort of like being a Marvel superhero: there is plenty of work for everyone.
Guest: Aaron Frazer
The strangest festival season in the history of festival seasons comes to a close. So we recap Shaky Knees 2021 and ask the big question like, what have we learned? Plus the standout performance of Festival Season 2021, Aaron Frazier from Durant Jones and the Indications, our guest today on the What Podcast, Barry Courter, Brad Steiner, Laura Taca. It starts right now! That kid's insane. Happy pod day to you. What podcast? It's a very quarter Brad Steiner, Lord Taco. Welcome in guys. I feel like it's been a minute. How's everyone been? Great. It's doing great. Good show. We'll talk to you guys next week. We'll check in later. Hey, by the way, I'm really excited that Barry, apparently you've been shopping at the same place that Russ gets chairs for his bus for that shirt come from plaid man plans the new thing. Uh huh. Uh huh. You guys didn't tell me you didn't tell me where plaid thing. Yeah, I mean, you look like tacos chair. Look at this. The same print. Yeah. Well, like I said, always fashion forward. You know what? You do always say that Barry. It's a great point. I forgot that that's one of your go to lines. You know, you're wearing a plaid shirt as well. Don't you? I know that, but it's not the same print that what tacos sitting on in his, it's not 1972 bus. Fair enough. So very, very busy day as we return to the podcast this week, excited with talk a little bit of shaky knees. I've got a topic that I want to dive into a little bit later on in the show that I have not even broached with you guys yet. So we'll get to that here in a second. But the big news today is that we have yet another artist for me to dork out on. I get to totally geek out yet again. I feel like this whole season, Barry has just been one big geek fest for me. Yeah. Are we going to do, we're going to do that as part of this same show. We're going to make this two shows. No, I think. Well, I mean, I think it, I think it's, I hope to do it this week. Okay. I don't want to tease people as well. Yeah, no, I'm excited too. I am worried about you though. This is your cause you're going to be ugly. You're going to be gross because you did it already without even talking to him. What do you mean? I mean, you've already gone on him. How much you love this guy. I do. I know it's going to be looking the screen. I know it's, he is great. He's, he's not just great, but he's so dreamy. Oh, so dreamy. Here we go. Our guest today, Aaron Frazier from Durant Jones and the indications. If you've been paying attention to the other shows in the last couple of weeks when I, I mean, I I've been a fan of Durant Jones and the indications for a minute. And when Aaron Frazier put out his solo album that was produced by Dan Arbok, I really caught attention to him and then I just sort of, I just fell hard and fast over that album. And then the live show at ACL was the best show I've seen literally all year. And to be able to like circle back and talk to him afterwards is really exciting. And hopefully we'll have Durant Jones on in another show coming up in the, in the coming weeks. But, you know, I want to sort of start, if you don't mind with some of the things that have happened in the past couple of weeks that we've missed, one of which being shaky knees. So, um, kind of surprised shaky knees actually happened, but it's a C three festival. So you know, C three has been able to navigate these waters a lot easier than everybody else. Taco, you went there. Did you go? Did you know I did not, you know, why, you know, why didn't go taco? Why didn't he go? It was further than 10 minutes from his house. Partly true. It was actually was outside of that 60 mile radius. I didn't see Barry's couch there. Yeah. Manchester. That's his shirt. That is his shirt. Manchester is my limit. I, uh, I really do not. I mean, Barry, what is the last vacation you've taken that didn't include like going to see a family member? Like when's the one time Barry has gone on vacation somewhere? I was going to say that's actually part of why I didn't go is because I went on vacation to see a family member. When is I couldn't tell you. Usually you go on vacation to get away from family members. Not in my house. Yeah. I mean, you go, you do take one trip a year to the beach. But other than that, where is like Barry's big trip to Paris or, you know, California or like, where's, where's that trip? When's the last time you did something like that? That is a great question. It's been 15 years. Paris, Paris would be great for Barry. He's so fashion forward. This would be good. Yeah. I could, can I wear this over there? Yeah. You fit right in. Yeah. You should, you should know too. They think you're a local. I'm I'm I've matched sweat pants with this on Psalm two. So can we see them? No, no. Why not? Cause it's terrible. Please. I'm begging you. I'm begging you. This is the one and only time you're going to hear me say the words. I want to see your pants. I don't think so. Show your pants. Show your pants. I'm not going to do it, but anyway, that's a great question. Now I haven't been on a vacation in, that's it. That's embarrassing. I know. It's really tough to hear. Yeah. You have it. I don't even have the last time you went to Atlanta or Nashville. No, no. And it's, it has a lot to do with, I mean, just Barry, the kids moved down to the streets. They moved out 15 years ago. This was the time you were supposed to go do things. Well, there's a lot, there's, there's reasons for it. One, my wife works a lot and she doesn't like to travel. She won't get on an airplane, for example. Oh wait, I got it. I know the last, I know the last vacation you've had. It was with me. Yeah, that's right. Louisville. We went to Louisville together. That was, that was about it. Yeah, man. That was taco. Imagine if the life you led, the only vacation you had in 15 years was with me. That's pitiful. Can't decide if that's a sad life or a fulfilling life. Yeah. That's the other thing. We have a good time here. Okay. Right. The palatial Barry Courter estate. All right. Let's, let's go through a Shakenese. I feel like a taco. You went to every show at Shakenese. I went to a lot of shows. Did you literally see every band that was on the bill? No, but I mean, I got pretty close. I got a list. Let's see. I hit one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 20 shows. That's gotta be more than half. That is a pack. I mean, for a festival that's only got three days and you know, they're only running from like three to 10 PM anyway. Yeah. That is a big, big festival. You did a lot. Taco. You got a lot of credit on that. You won't see 20 bands at Bonnaroo. No, no, I was just thinking that's two years for you and me, Brad. So give me, give me, give me some highlights. Who did you like the most? I think the biggest highlight for me was probably garbage. What? Yeah. Yeah. Really? It was fantastic. Yeah. Or a garage as Kelsey kept calling them. I was like, no, it's garbage. Not garage. Garage. He must be 25. Yeah. He must have no idea who that is. So I bet she had no idea. Did she know any of the songs? I mean, this is a number. Not one clue what he just was. Yeah. Wow. Was it your intention to see all 20 or did it just work out that way? Did you all have a plan on that? It just worked out that way. There was really, you know, not a whole lot else to do there. You know, it's not like Bonnaroo where there's events and tents and- Where? You're there. You know, when you're there. So I was there. I can't wait for T-shirt number two from the What Podcast. And literally just in the front of it says, you're there. You're there. You're there. So Garbage, big highlight. That's surprising, you know, because they're one of those bands that, you know, I will say every now and then Shakin' Ease does seem to pluck a band that's not on anyone else's radar. And they did that. I mean, I don't know another festival that Garbage was even part of. Frankly, I don't even know if Garbage was doing shows anymore. Well, they said this was like, I don't know, the first show they've done in the States in years. I mean, they really haven't been doing shows. So how they got to Shakin' Ease, I have no idea. Yeah, that's a strange one. Imagine the cost that, you know, put the festival back. I'd love to know how much they paid for Garbage. That's an interesting one. Who else like? Run the Jules. Run the Jules were good. It took me a couple of songs to get sold on this because I've never really like explored Run the Jules that much. But like literally everybody's told me that you got to see the show. You got to see the show. So, you know, it finally clicked and I was like, OK. And I think being in Atlanta where Killer Mike is from, I mean, he was just. Yeah, that's a great time. I mean, that's really the best place to see Run the Jules. I think it's in Atlanta. Honestly, I think that's the best place to see any band is their hometown. I've seen Spoon two dozen times in my life. It's never been better than it was at ACL. You know, the Black Pumas show. How many times I saw him in a year. That show is at Austin. You know, I think it the hometown thing just always seems to work that Alabama Shakes always play better when she's in Nashville for some odd reason. Yeah, that morning jacket show in Louisville, the one you just referred to. Is that where he's from? Yeah, that's where they're from. The band, the whole band. Oh, wait, side note, I've got an opportunity to see my morning jacket on Halloween. I'm passing up. Barry, do you want to come down? I can get you in. Kill me. You want to if you want to go to have a little vacation. That would be the one. That's how you'll get them in. I mean, I want my playing at the. I actually don't know. I don't know. I just don't know. It's not a huge. It's not the the. I don't. I really know. It's not the stadium. I don't know off the top of my head. I know I know widespread panic is in town doing three nights this weekend to somewhere. I just I don't I don't remember. But yeah, I love the run the jewels pick mainly because they're another one that I don't just sit around listening to. I go deep and heavy when the album comes out and I feel like that's all I listen to for about a week and then I don't really ever pick it back up. Yeah, weirdly enough. But yet that live show always hits. It always is so big. It was huge. And last song he brought his kids out on stage. It was just it was pretty cool. Yeah, pretty cool. Yeah, there's always there's always a little touch. Like Killer Mike's always got something up his sleeve with every show that he hasn't. I mean, I got to this point where like I love run the jewels so much. I've got these lapel pins and I had to stop wearing, especially like during like the really tough stuff like the George Floyd things. I didn't really want to walk around with a hand pointed like a gun on my lapel. You know, I felt very awkward about that, but it's really one of my favorite possessions. This is my run the jewels lapel. I love them that much. All right. Who else? Food fighters, of course, were flawless. I mean, they put on just fantastic show. How long was it? It was the longest one. It started at eight forty five and went to eleven. So that's all right. I mean, tame. That's very tame for them. Well, you know, I think they wanted to play more. They couldn't do an encore. They ran out of time. Yeah, they played right up until eleven and then they were like, you got to get out. Like, I mean, the whole the whole park shuts down. You have to leave like immediately. So there's no sticking around waiting for an encore. You're getting pushed out. I don't find the facilities in the space of shaky knees to be the best. It's just because it's surrounded by a neighborhood. There's really nowhere to go. Right. You know, there's the there's you're surrounded by houses. Those houses, if you do have an Airbnb in the neighborhood, it's going to cost you three four hundred dollars a night. It might as well be at Coachella. And then the other thing, too, is good luck getting an Uber out of there. There's just thousands and thousands of kids just sitting there waiting on the corner for exactly what you're looking for. What was your plan to get out of the venue? Surprisingly, we got an Uber quickly. Stop it. No, four minutes. Yeah. Well, I don't know how. I didn't expect that. I thought we're going to be, you know, standing here for an hour waiting on. But no, it said, OK, we'll pick you up. Really? How far away were you staying from the venue? About 45 minutes. So you couldn't bird it. No, no, no. Getting there. Now we were able to ride the train. We stay with some friends, some family friends. They've got a house like in Sandy Springs ish. They dropped us off at the train station. We rode the train in, walked about 15 minutes and we're there. So really getting in and out. How about that? So you are now the second person in my life, only the second person I've ever heard take that train. It was fantastic. Yeah. My brother always said the same thing. My brother always said that the secret of that city is that train and nobody takes it. Actually, the last time I was there, I took the train. We took the train in from Alpharetta. Barry, that was a horse and buggy. Yeah, I know. It was a while ago. But yeah, the train was great. Unfortunately, I don't think the train runs too late at night. So by the time the festival was over, we had to Uber back. And that was kind of a long Uber. But yeah, train worked out. And that was part of the problem was they kick you out at 11. And what does everybody do right at the end of the last song? You got to go to the bathroom before you leave. So people are queuing up in these long lines and they're trying to close the bathrooms being like, no, these are closed. And I mean, people are getting mad. You can't mess with people's bladders like that. People were going behind the bathrooms and peeing in the woods. And I just I mean, I thought the fight was going to break up. I live in New Orleans. Everything smells like piss. I mean, I don't really see anything wrong with being on the side of the road. Nice. Let me go through some of these others. What do you think of? What do you think of a new best friend, Isaac and Modest Mouse? How's the modest mouse was great. That was a great show. I feel like they they have hit some sort of of. They're in the pocket of their career right now. I don't think they've ever sounded better. I really don't. They sounded really great. Did I tell you guys my Isaac Brock story? Did I tell this the last show? He has that for some odd reason. Isaac must have taken a liking to a Brad guy. We we talked for like an hour and a half before the show. He tells me to come back after the show. We spent another hour after that talking. He calls me the next morning and he just calls. He's like, hey, Brad, just call and say hey. Like, hey, Isaac, what you doing? He's like, I'm in Orlando. I'm thinking about going to a magic store. Why? OK, that sounds great. Why are you going to a magic store? Isaac, he said, well, there's this card trick that I really want to buy. I saw it last time I was here. And you can control a card from across the room. And I've been thinking about that every day since. So it's a rocket magic store. I fell in love. I fell absolutely in love with it. I'm this is what goes through his mind every day. I mean, if I got a call, Brad, tell him to. Please call me next time. Barry goes to a magic store. And the other one that I'm interested in is the strokes. Uh, hmm. Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about that stroke show. Yeah. I'm sure you've seen the strokes. I have not. Really? Well, this is my first time. And first of all, they were 15 minutes late, which is very unusual because every show started on time. Yeah, that's early for the strokes. Well, that's what I've heard. Yeah. Uh, Julian seemed wasted or out of his mind or whatever. You know, he just couldn't wasn't coherent. They'd start playing a song. He would like, stop, stop, stop. And he'd say something like, I don't remember the lyrics. Oh, really? It was so strange. Oh, yeah. And at one point they all walked off. There was like 20 minutes left and they just walked off. We're like, what is going on? And then they come back and they pick up and they finish playing. Yeah. It was very strange. And lots of comments that I read, like on Reddit and Twitter, you know, people were pissed off about that show. And but but about half of the other people were like, no, that's just their thing. That's just what they do. Well, it is. But I mean, infighting is sort of their thing. Yeah. Yeah. I that's fascinating. The reason I specified or tried to point out the strokes is because they from everything that I know, they've got a new album coming. And not only do they have a new album coming, but I think you could put every dollar you have on them being a boderoo next year. Everything is setting up for them to be doing most festivals next year. So, you know, if if they haven't figured it out for a shaky knee show off cycle, I don't know how that's going to go. You know, they try to do a whole nother tour with I know they've got new management. So maybe there's maybe right. Maybe it's just it's just like an off time and they'll pull it together by the time a new cycle starts. But I think that if if you if you were to put smart money down, I think the strokes is almost a lock for Bonnaroo. There you go. And the band themselves were playing extremely well. I mean, they were everybody was on point. It was just Julian and the band seemed like physically upset that he just couldn't keep it together. Like they're all trying to play this show and he's just whatever. So interesting. I mean, I don't think that that take is unlike many takes that you hear about stroke shows. It really is a coin flip. Yeah. I was curious if that's like par for the course, because some people were saying, oh, yeah, that's just that's just the way it goes. I don't know, man. Yeah, that doesn't last long. No, it does not. But but you know, but Barry, it's lasted for almost 20 years. Yeah, fair enough. I mean, when did last night come out? Yeah, exactly. I mean, we're we're like 15 plus years on the show here. I mean, I heard all the stroke songs that I wanted to hear, expected to hear. Nothing. No, no, nothing really new. The other one that I was kind of like man on was Alice Cooper. What? Really? I know. Well, I mean, you weren't there with us at the Bonner show, were you? No. OK. Now, that was the that was the year before you, wasn't it, Barry? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, that was great. I saw I've seen him. I saw him here at the auditorium. It was terrific. It's campy and silly. Everything you want is in. And it was and is. Go ahead. I'm sorry. The band was was on point. It was a technically good show. I mean, he was doing everything he was supposed to, but it just felt like, you know, he's been doing this show for it's goofy. But he's like been doing this for what? 30, 40 years. He comes out. There's no there's no banter. There's no talking to the audience. There's no improvisation. He's just like, they're just doing the songs and then that's it. It was just the improv comes from the guitar players. Yeah. And he had some very good guitar players on there, including a female guitar player. Nina Strauss. Yeah, she's amazing. Yeah, that was all amazing. But it was just I don't know. After hearing, you know, Killer Mike and LP like back and forth in between songs, it was like this is I felt like this is more what you're here for to see at a festival like. So this isn't a side and this will matter to no one that's listening other than me and Taco. But the person that you went with, did she care about any of these things? No. OK. In fact, did she stick around with you through this or did she go find some sort of dude to have attention to get attention from? She got attention from a dude. OK, yeah. And we'll get to that. We'll talk about what happened Friday night, too. But oh, God, well, let's hear it. I can't wait. Well, that Alice Cooper show, I don't think I saw anyone under 40. You know, I don't think Alice Cooper is on anyone's radar except like people our age, Barry. There's no question that the show that we saw at the auditorium. I take very big. I'm taking this. I feel like I've been attacked. I mean, you're 40. I am not very the same age. I said our age. Well, don't include Barry on that. I said our age and up. OK, now I'm offended. Now I'm offended. But but the audience, the audience that saw Alice at the auditorium here looked very much like the 1700 comic book shop owners. Yes. Question about it. Exactly. Yeah. Vintage T-shirts. It felt like I was at exit 111 again. Comic book store owners. I have a random I have a random question. Did you happen to see all them witches? I did. Did you like them? Yes. That was one I definitely didn't want to miss. And that was really my only conflict because all the witches was opposite Phoebe Bridgers. And I really want to see Phoebe Bridgers, but all the witches was my Bonnaroo 19 Thursday night was one of my Thursday night picks that I wanted to see. And that's the night that I eat the cookie. Gotcha. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah. And you don't do well with Thursday night. It's got to upset Tommy. Yeah, you don't do well with sweets. I've got too many chocolate chips. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Your body can't handle sugar. No, it really it upset me. You know, so I had to lay down. OK. For nine hours. And yeah, we're sort of like honor your first year. Weird how you just took a day off. I think that's what he's talking about. Yeah. So all the witches was I definitely had to see them live in color hives. Those were all great. I how I forgot all about the hives. I didn't know they were still around. I didn't say for all of it, you know, or live in color, but those are both great shows. I mean, I'm kind of I didn't tell you guys this story about ACL. But one of the things I'm more disappointed in myself with was I left Phoebe Bridgers early, mainly because it just the crowd was they were just so young and the girls were just everywhere. And I felt like I was watching Billy. I wish again. And and although I could see something good was happening and I knew it was I knew it sounded good, I knew there was a moment surrounding it. I left because, A, the crowd just wasn't working for me. And then B, you know, that first half an hour is really sleepy. So I left to go see a band that I think I'm good for never seeing ever again. I love, love, love future islands. But I don't need to see him fake rip off his own face anymore. He runs the same bit every time he's pounding on his chest. He's punching himself in the face. He's ripping his invisible face off. You know, he's collapsing to the ground. It's a great show if you've never seen it. He's I love everything about them. But man, if you've seen it once and I've seen it six times and I don't know why I decided to leave Phoebe Bridgers to go see that again. And I felt so bad about it. I should have told you before the shaky knees. I should have told you to not miss Phoebe Bridgers, because if I'm not mistaken, there's somebody that she brought out at the end of that show at ACL that had everybody talking. And I heard it from afar. And I just dipped my head and walked away because I just I didn't want to deal with my own failures. Yeah, I I probably should have gone to that Phoebe Bridgers show, too. But that was that was a tough decision. But I went I went all them witches. Yeah. And then you got ditched. You got all them ditches. You got all them ditches. So you got ditched, huh? Who got ditched? Me. You. Yeah. And that's the story. Oh, I thought there was a story about the partner in crime. So Friday night, she meets up with one of her friends. And then after the show, he's like, Hey, y'all, let's go to this bar downtown like my friends own it. It's a great bar. Great people. Like, let's go check it out. And we're like, OK. So we leave the festival and we just start walking and walking and walking for like an hour and a half. And we're just walking. And, you know, we're passing up all these like bars. And I'm like, that bar looks cool. Can we just go here? Like how much turns out you already back to Sandy Springs. Yeah, pretty much. We sobered up. And yeah, I mean, I was completely sober by the time we, you know, finished walking. We stopped. And, you know, we're like, how much further is this? And he's like, I think it's just like another block up ahead. And I pull it up and I'm like, we're getting an Uber because it still says we're like 40 minutes away. Oh, my God. It was terrible. I could not. I could barely walk the next day from like, oh, my God. I could barely walk the next day from like just constant walking. I literally had shaky knees. Yeah. Oh, he's hanging on to that for. Oh, yeah. But the bar was pretty good. I got a drink. We all got drinks. I was it worth walking, you know, two hours? Probably not. Was it a PBR? Definitely not. Wow. Yeah. Oh, that's strong. There you go. Another another strike against him. Upscale bar. It was pretty fancy. This is big. This is the man walked all the way and didn't even get a PBR. Didn't even get his PBR. I know. Yeah. Stunning. All right. Well, anything else of note for a shaky knees? I think that's about it. Oh, they were checking vaccine cards and your ID, but they weren't doing testing on site, which I thought was weird. So I go back. Do I want to go back to Shakeney's? Yeah. I don't know. It's exhausting. It's one of those it's one of those festivals that so line up dependent. Yeah, that was my next question. If I was waiting for him to say that, yeah, I was there strictly for the lineup, not the experience, because honestly, it's so exhausting because every single day you have to figure out how you're getting from where you're staying to the venue and then get home. And it's not like Bonnaroo where you just, you know, party until you get tired and then walk to camp and pass out. You know, the only way the only way I'm willing to do that festival again. One is if I'm going up and down and only go for a day and I stay in Chattanooga or I get a house in the neighborhood and you can just walk from the neighborhood. But even then, frankly, you know, that's no good either, because don't you want to go out? Exactly. Yeah. You know, so you're damned if you do damned if you don't. It's just in such a weird part of town where nothing else is around. I mean, there's a there's a mallow mushroom you can go to. And that's about it. That's about it. So I've got I've got other festival items, some news, some festival news to share with us here shortly after Aaron Frazier, which, by the way, somebody catch me if I call him Aaron Jones. I have accidentally called him Aaron Jones, the running back for the Green Bay Packers, maybe two dozen times. I don't know why I keep doing that. But Aaron Frazier, very excited about this. Next on the What Podcast. Aaron Frazier, how are you, stranger? Doing well. I I hate to be this guy, but ever since ACL, I have done nothing but wax poetic to these two about Aaron Frazier, Aaron Frazier, Aaron Frazier. Thank you. I'm jealous of the hair. I'm jealous of this, the fashion. I'm jealous of the smooth. It's the smoothest cat in the world, Barry Courter. I'm glad I got on this call. And I feel like this is great. Well, hang on to that, Aaron, because it could get weird. He's not kidding. Well, I mean, I told you this after the show. I mean, what was so remarkable about what you did at ACL was that you just hadn't done it before. You know, it was your first ever solo festival performance, right? Yeah, yeah, it was, which is intense. You know, it's it's asking a lot of my bandmates to learn all this stuff and to have it together, to do it under pressure of, you know, not just a live show, but a festival live show, which, you know, if anybody out there has been to or played a festival, you know, changeovers are very, very fast. You're on a schedule. The schedule doesn't stop for you. It doesn't slow down just because you're like it's ready or not. You're set is like starting. So they killed it. I was happy to be there. I mean, that's fine. I ran into Steve afterwards. And it felt like he had lost about 30 pounds because it Mary, if you like. So Duran Jones has got, you know, the band. And then I think Aaron, you used not just the bass player, but also the keyboardist, Steve, and maybe even guitars, too, from Duran Jones. Different different guitar player. They both have long hair. But yeah. And so and so Steve, the keyboardist, he's just one of these guys that every time, you know, they play, all you hear from the crowd is, Steve, it's really funny. It's become like a running bit with with these guys. And then so I talked to him afterwards and I was like, you played. It feels like 15 shows this weekend. He's like, I know it was it was a lot. So I can't imagine like the amount of just bandwidth that that kind of stuff takes out of you. Yeah, it's definitely a balance. And it's one I'm excited to like, you know, continue to figure out. But just to have been given that space by my bandmates, you know, not just Mike and Steve, you know, who are given their time and their energy to to this stuff as well, but also to to Blake and Duran to trust me and us to to take that space and and dedicate that energy to my own thing and then still be able to go back to the band. It's a strong collective. And yeah, it's it's cool. Well, let's jump in the spirit of that, because I know we just started, but it's such a good question and a good spot because Brad really did go on and on when we talked a couple of weeks ago about how impressed he was with this show and how it happened and you going from one to the other. And you just said it was the first time. I mean, what was that like? You talked about it a little bit already, but I mean, that's just not something you wake up and it just happened, right? I mean, it's a pretty intense thing and to be in that environment and all of that. So, yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's stress, obviously. But it was more emotional, you know, than I than I thought it would be to play these songs that, you know, every song I write is coming from from a real place. But the songs on the solo record are like, I think, probably the most vulnerable I have I have gotten as a writer. It's a little closer to the bone, you know, and so and it's your name on it. Yeah, absolutely. And so to perform those songs and then to not just see people who are coming out to like, you know, I guess, like listeners, fans, whatever you want to call them like. But also, you know, my lady was was in the crowd. And then also at the back of the crowd were Blake and Duran were like dancing dancer the the Blets off. And so it was I just felt very held and supported by the community in that moment. And yeah, especially. Yeah, I mean, you know, it was a big show because Adrian from Black Pumas told me. I walked up, I said, wow, you're coming here. He's like, I only came to see Aaron. I only came all the way down here to see Aaron. That's that says something, you know, to get his own house. I'm I'm I'm really happy for Adrian and what he's accomplished. You know, I mean, even before the Black Pumas, but now with the Black Pumas, like opening up Instagram and seeing them in a stadium playing with Rolling Stones. It's just like that's that's my guy, man. Yeah, that's that's pretty nuts. I want to start sort of from the beginning, mainly because, you know, Duran Jones and the Indications have always been one of those bands that, you know, was on my radar, mainly because if you if you do any sort of this new soul stuff, you know, you find the Charles Bradleys, you find the Lee Fields, you know, Sharon Jones to started it all. You eventually get to Duran Jones. And, you know, it kept poking at me and poking at me and poking at me until I finally just started saying, OK, let's let's see what this is. I had no idea when I picked you guys up in 2018, 2019, that it was like a 10 year old thing already. I mean, or maybe not even 10 at that point. But you guys have been together and doing this for a while. And it all started from, ironically enough. I mean, I don't know if Barry knows this, but Duran's from New Orleans. I even I talked to him about that at ACL. He was born in New Orleans and grew up outside of Baton Rouge. Just explain how the paths crossed and how this whole thing came together. Yeah, so, let's see, Blake Ryan, the guitar player, and I met first day of college. We had the same major, which is audio engineering. It's a very small program. It's only 15 kids per year. So, you know, you kind of become fast friends. And we were, you know, we bonded over. The first thing we ever bonded over was hip hop. Like sample based hip hop was like donuts, really. J Dilla's donuts. And that's a lot of how like I found soul music for myself was filtered through samples. A lot of Syl Johnson, I imagine. Yeah, I mean, a lot of a lot of funky drummer, a lot of, you know, I don't know, Curtis Mayfield and Dills Kahar and all that. But Duran came to Bloomington from New Orleans. And he came to Indiana University to study classical saxophone to get a graduate degree. So he wasn't even there to pursue soul music. But he was helping out as a horn coach for the student soul music ensemble. And he was helping out as a horn coach for the student soul music ensemble. Called this IU Soul Review. Wow. Which is a really interesting program. There's there. I don't think there's many like it in the country where students learn about soul music and then perform it. It's like, you know, it's a performance class. This is all at Indiana University. Yeah. Yeah. Really interesting place where I thought was be the hub of soul. Yeah. Yeah. The heart of soul is not five. Jackson five. Jackson five. Jackson five. Hold on. Jackson five. That's Gary. That's true. It's Gary. It's Gary. That's a very fair distinction. But it's a great it has a great history as a as a as an ensemble, as a class. So anyway, so he was the horn coach and Blake was running sound because he was in the audio program. You have to run sound for various ensembles on campus. So by that time, I guess we were juniors in college. Duran was a little bit older. Blake and I had started a rock and roll band with two other of our classmates. And so in that soul ensemble, they were a little short on male singers that year. And so they pulled Duran because they knew he had a little bit of like singing experience. And Blake heard him sing and was like, yo, you should come meet my friend, Aaron. You know, we've been making rock and roll together. But over time, we'd been talking about wanting to make stuff, you know, more hip hop, soul, influence, stuff like that. And in this band currently, you're playing drums. Correct. Yeah, I was playing drums and singing also. But I was singing with my full chest voice. Yeah. OK. And that's basically how it started. We we started hanging out on Sundays. We called him Soul Sundays. And we would get together in my apartment. And well, actually, there's a house because in the Midwest now I'm here in Brooklyn in an apartment. But we would spend forty fives and like talk about, you know, it was almost like a like a reading group, like a. Yeah, it's like a book club. You know, you get together, you just like you play it, drop the needle, you listen. And you just get what I loved about that was how mess up the bass sounds. It's like way too loud and out of tune. And I love that. You know, like, you know, the drums are super fat or I love how the vocal harmonies are. And and then we just like go down in the basement and mess around and jam. And that was that was how Duran Jones and the indications started. It was never supposed to grow into a whole career. We really were just hanging out. Very these are these are people that I want to be best friends with, because this is legitimately the kind of conversations that I have with myself every Sunday. I just sit there and I just pick out soul records. And I don't know anybody else that can nerd out with me about these things. Well, I love this whole recap because you mentioned some of the things I was thinking about when I was listening to the music today and reading and everything. Gil Scout, Heron, Curtis Mayfield. But and I mean this with all respect. At one point, I thought this sounds like a group of people that are really, really good in like band. Or, you know, music school and then have taken it to this next level. And so, I mean, that's just, you know, we were all part of the music school. But it's interesting, like, you know, being in an audio major, not a performance major. We were like nerds in a different way. Like, I mean, yeah, I got you, I got you. But it was sort of like, you know, what I feel like I got out of that studying audio was how to put words to what I'm hearing. Because like, you know, language influences like thought in this really crazy way where like if you're unfamiliar with the term compression, you might not you might have trouble perceiving it. It can just be this this invisible thing. And then once you kind of understand what it is, have a word for it for the song kind of blinking, you know, whatever. Then not only can you describe it to somebody, but you can chase after it yourself in a songwriting context. Oh, that is that is exactly you just described something that I fight with my engineer here at the radio station about all the time, because I have no idea what I'm saying. But I do know what I'm hearing and I don't know how to transcribe it to another person, especially somebody knows what they're talking about. I one time went to this really fancy restaurant in Chicago, one of my favorite restaurants in the world. And the sommelier walks out and we're talking about orange wines and, you know, give me the. So he brings over the orange wine. He asked me what I like, what I like. And I said, you know, I just wish it was more punchy. And this guy's eyes bugged out of his head and he said, punchy. He was so offended by this word that I had used. But in my world, I wanted it just to be boozier. But in his world, he thought I wanted Kool-Aid. Yeah, I was just thinking. Oh, punchy like, oh, my God, that's funny. Yeah. You know, but the beautiful thing about music is like, you know, and Blake and I, neither of us are classically trained or classically trained. But it's so much like it's the only rule is it has to work. Right. It doesn't matter if like the microphone is on the ground, literally on the ground, not even a mic, not even on a mic stand or the vocals are way blown out. If it sounds good, if it moves you, then that's right. And in the same way, I think like, you know, when you're chasing after a sound, the our new record with the indications is mixed by Ben Kane, a great engineer here in Brooklyn, who has worked with D'Angelo. He works with D'Angelo, Emily King, those kinds of people. And he he he told us a story about D'Angelo describing like, hey, I want the vocals to hit like ink when you drop ink into water. And it's just sort of like, OK, all right, let's chase that. Let's try to make it feel like something rather than getting too eggheady with it. So I like. Yeah, I don't I don't want to skip over some of the meat on the bone. But I mean, I got to imagine knowing at least the small time that I spent with Dan Arbok, he's sort of like that, too. He's totally like that. Yeah. So so when when you're in there now, I'm fast forwarding a little bit past you finding the voice that you you share with us today. But and we can come back to that. But when you get into a room with Dan, do you have a pretty good solid idea as to what you want to do or is Dan sort of like taking over and coloring this thing for you? It's a really collaborative process. You know, I was I didn't know what to expect, you know, because Dan is a rock star, like a global rock star. Like they don't make them like that anymore. You know. And I don't think you get to that point without, a, having a very clear vision and, b, being able to advocate strongly for that vision. So like, I don't know. I was like, I don't want to get steamrolled. I hope that's not the case. But it wasn't it wasn't like that at all. You know, and I think part of the reason when we first started talking, you know, he called me directly, which is not usually how these things work. Normally, it's like through this person goes to the label, goes to management, goes to management, goes to label, whatever. It's like so roundabout. But he just called me on the phone, you know, from, you know, Ohio number. And but did he did he see you in a solo show? Did he see you? No, he isn't any wonder that he found. Yes. And then he also heard my gospel record that I did in 2017, the Flying Stars of Brooklyn. Again, that, you know, you talk about low five, the only rule that has to work is like my guitar amp was on my toilet in for that recording. And it's been, you know, stream millions and millions of times. That's hysterical. But when when when Dan, I first started talking, the conversation quickly became like YouTube link, YouTube link, YouTube link, YouTube link in this musical conversation of just like, OK, here's what I'm digging on. Oh, that reminds me that that reminds me of that, because all every record is in conversation with like five other records. Yeah. And so when you're tapped into it and you and you start to kind of you can see the matrix and you're like, oh, they're all connected. They're like, yeah, there are genres, but like also in some ways they are really just totally arbitrary like boundaries. That that had to help with your I was going to ask about your internal conversation, because like you said, you don't want to get steamrolled. Yeah. And this is always fascinates me, this whole producer artist, you know, how much does who contribute what and who lets who leads and who pulls and who pushes and and all that kind of stuff? I made, you know, I made him a playlist that maybe I should share one day, but it was it was called Dan and Aaron Make a Record Together, maybe because we hadn't, you know, we hadn't signed anything. So I sent it to him and I was like, these are all in the same way that I would get together with Blake and Durand. It's like that's what helped create a shared vision to where you can see the same house before it's done being built, you know, is is common reference points, common, you know, recordings that we can point to. And that way, also going into it, I mean, I'm trying to learn, you know, Dan's one of the one of the best, like not just alive. He's just like one of the best, you know. And so I what I would what I was hoping for and what happened was just like, let's create this common framework of recordings we both love. And then within this, if there's a situation where it's like, oh, I think you should do it like this, then I'm like, OK, cool. Let me trust this. Let me learn. Let me just see where this road takes me. And then in moments where I was like, man, this horn melody, it's like this is how I'm hearing it like this. It's like that's what's up, Chase. It I mean, I think that there's something like I can't talk about Dan Arbok. Look, I think that he's a great rock star, but he's an even better producer. And, you know, his shop, I mean, Alan is incredible over there. I have a feeling, though. I have a feeling, though. You talk to Dan Arbok and he found your gospel album right about right about when he started making that CeeLo out. Did he play that for you? So Dan has these Dan has projects that he just they just there's hundreds of them that he just has sitting around. He's like he finds these guys like Aaron and, you know, he just dies to work with him. He did a CeeLo project that is nothing but Teddy Pendergrass, like soul slash gospel music that is incredible, absolutely incredible, and no one will ever hear it. I did. I didn't I wasn't aware that that it got shelved, but I did hear a couple of cuts and it is beautiful. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. And I have a feeling like that there is somewhere around there. I have a feeling it's the same timeline. Yeah, it very well could be. I mean, you know, one of the things that one of the things that Dan really encouraged me to do was to kind of use this as an opportunity to think outside of any box that not like that, like people have put me in, but like that I may have put myself in, you know, as an artist to be like, oh, this is what people know me for. So this is what it has to be. So that means that I am this. It's like for him, I think especially it makes sense. Like, you know, I mean, the Black Keys were going in since like, what, like 2000 on like this this one lane. But both Dan and Pat, I know have they contain multitudes like any artist does, you know, like any person does. And so EZ, I think, has become a place for him to explore all those sides of his artistic self and then to also encourage artists, you know, like me to do the same. Now, how different is the finished product than what you originally thought maybe going in? Interesting. That's interesting. So much of the record was written in the room, you know, with me and Dan and in the kitchen at EZ, you know, and then one other person usually. But so my favorite times were just us. But by the way, the same at that same table, he wrote the Lana Del Rey record, by the way. I didn't know he did it. That's cool. That kitchen has got some power to it. Yeah, it's Vibe. I mean, it actually makes sense to me when I walked in there and got to know Dan a little bit more and learned that his dad was an antique stealer. Still is. And so to grow up around old weird stuff, like to grow up around Vibe stuff all the time and somebody older than you, you know, a person in your life to kind of give you that magic eye. You walk in there and every surface has Vibe, every surface has something, some ephemera from some Ohio church or a kick drum from a, you know, I don't know, fire department in the 1800s or something. Just like weird, weird. Bobby Woods glass eyes on the mix. I think that that's such a great point because you can't tell you can't you can't have taste without seeing taste, I think. Right. So you don't know what quality if you don't surround yourself with quality is a really strong point. OK, so the thing that we missed was the day that you sort of came out of your shell and figured out you. You talked earlier about your your your chest voice, which you still use to this day. I mean, you played with it back and forth in some of your in some of the songs in the record. But the moment where you found that signature sound, that unique, unbelievable, just I mean, cuts glass kind of sound. Where did where did that come from? How did you find it? Thank you. You know, talking about being a nerd, I just I don't love large crowds. I mean, I love playing to him. You know what I'm saying? I mean, you know, I'll play to thousands of people and it's super fun. But I don't love being in large crowds. I don't love like super loud music or whatever. Anyway, so in college, at a certain point after doing the bar thing for a while, I started just like on Friday nights for a stretch of time, I'd like stay in and try to write songs in different genres and different styles just because I've always loved lots of different kinds of music. So, yeah, one night I wrote like a really simple soul song called Is It Any Wonder? And I sang it in my chest voice and I like listened back to it and was just like, yeah, this is not great. I just wasn't it just didn't feel just didn't feel authentic to me for some reason. It was just off the mark. So I was like, but, you know, Duran could do a great job with this because he could sing anything and make it sound good. So I brought it to Blake, our guitar player, and he's like, cool, let's let's recut this. So we recut the instrumental and then I was recording scratch vocals for Duran to replace. And we were laying I was sitting on the couch feeling, you know, especially relaxed in that moment. And because I was kind of laying back, I wasn't projecting from my diaphragm and my chest. I was coming from my head voice. And that's what came out, actually. The vocals on our first record, On Is It Any Wonder, are the scratch vocals. Wow. Replace them. It's like that's how we left it because we listened back drenched in reverb and delay. And we were like, oh, this is this is something. And for the first time in my life, I was able to hear myself back and not get that nails on the chalkboard cognitive dissonance that happens when you hear recording yourself. And you're just like, I can't I can't, you know. And it just sounded like me for the first time. I was like, yeah, no, I think that's what I sound like. Do you think there was a tad bit of and I hate to put words in your mouth, but is there a tad bit of insecurity in the chest voice? I think I think. I mean, there's there's insecurity when you put something out into the world. It's such a vulnerable place that you're always going to feel a certain level of insecurity in whatever style and however proficient you are. But I think it's it's maybe not as much the insecurity. I think it's because it's falsetto. It's false. Right. It's it's not your speaking voice. So you have a little bit of mental remove from it. So even if everybody heard my chest voice and they're like, cool, that sounds that sounds awesome. It's still you're like, I don't know. It's just like I'm just like speaking in in a melody. I don't know. It just kind of sounds like when there's that remove. I'm sorry. Is it almost like singing in character? Maybe so. Now it doesn't feel like it, but maybe there was a little bit of remove that helped me access a different part of myself creatively. I think in the same way that people write with pseudonyms, I was just about to say, I mean, it's kind of ironic that that's sort of a safety valve. I hate to use the term safety, but while the album is called Introducing Aaron Frazier, you know, it could have been frazz. You know, you could have come up with some sort of thing, but you were you were incredibly vulnerable in this entire process. And I actually think the falsetto thing is is not necessarily a cover. I feel like it's even more vulnerable. You know, I feel like it's even deeper inside of you than than, you know, just what you would describe as a chest voice. No. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, in some ways, I think that's right. Like, you know, some of the most vulnerable, tender performances have come from falsetto voices. You know, we talked about Curtis Mayfield and Smokey Robinson, but also a more contemporary example, not in soul music at all, is like the first Bon Iver record. Oh, you know what? Someone might call me out on that. I'm not sure it's the first one, but for Emma. Yeah, I'll call it the breakout. I think maybe there's some, you know, I know he was doing stuff before that. But in that moment, you can tell, like, damn, this guy is going through it. Yeah. You know, and he's he's holed up. He's holed up in a cabin. You know, yeah, I hear you. I think you're exactly right. And there's there's some fear there, which is, you know, that's why I pointed out the vulnerability part. I say you find this voice, you find the ability to to to write and you get in touch with Dan. And all while you're still with Duran Jones. All right. My final thing here and I'll stop nerding out with you here in a second. But my final thing is when you guys, when Duran and you are playing back and forth, if you've never seen the show, there it's a really brilliant mix of going back and forth. Right. And Duran is from all accounts that I have both witnessed and read about you guys. This is truly a a partnership in a way that goes back and forth. And I just got to imagine you guys are just scratching the surface with that kind of stuff. I think with you is a perfect blend of where I see or at least hear Duran Jones and indications go. Am I wrong about that? No, I feel that on which it does feel like we've traded off verses. But I love like in hip hop, you know, there are great duos, you know, Jadakiss and Styles P or Fat Joe and Big Pun. Or you listen to actually probably like the gold standard is Brooklyn's finest, Jay Z and Biggie. I mean, the track Brooklyn's finest, Jay Z and Biggie Smalls off reasonable doubt. They're like finishing each other's lines. They're going back and forth. It's thrilling to listen to still after all these years, I just got like goosebumps just thinking about it because it's like it's amazing. And so I'm excited to continue to explore that. And to your first point, Duran is such a generous front person in that way, because, you know, look, when Isn't Any Wonder as a song popped off and became one of the fan favorites on that record, it would have made a lot of sense if Duran was like, that's really cool, like chase that. But like, I'm the singer here. But it was never like that. My name's on the door. Exactly. But, you know, he's created so much space for me in this in this band and, you know, in this career that, you know, my goal is to find the places where I can also create that same space for him. Well, that's my next question. And not to put you on the spot in that in that line. But what do you want to do now that you've got this solo album? What is it a separate, completely separate thing? Where do you see it going? I mean, if I want to answer it for him, I mean, I think I think Aaron Frazier turns into Jack Antloff. I see I see Jack. I see Aaron Frazier producing a Taylor Swift one day. No, I think I think I think that everything that you're describing from the moment that you walked into Indiana University to the the the lessons that you learned through Durand and and with Dan, I it feels like there is a producing megastar that's, you know, scratching the surface here. Thank you. I mean, yeah, I that is a goal of mine is to is to work with other artists and to write with other artists. I'm headed out to L.A. actually next Monday, till the end of the year, to post up and just like. Just like, right, you know, with whoever is around, whoever wants to write, let's go, you know. And yeah, I think. You know, the way I see this band, I like to think about it like the Marvel Cinematic Universe, like the Avengers, because it's like, you know, you have these main storylines and then you can. It's so fun as a fan because you get to pick your favorite and then you follow them off into their little side stories, you know, or epic side stories, and they have their own hosts of collaborators. And then there are these crossover moments. And then you go back to the main storyline. You know, I told I told Blake, you know, our next record should just be called Durand Jones and the indications, Colin Infinity War, just go full of vengeance. No, I mean, that's that's how I that's my hope for this band is to to blossom into the collective that I think it has always been. And so to support everybody in exploring, explain their own their own creative side, because then it's also easier to come back to a collaboration. And the stakes are a little lower because you're not like, oh, this is my one place to get my song exactly the way I want it. And if it doesn't turn out that way or it's not on the record, it's a calamity. You know, it's not like that. It's like I have a valve. I have an outlet for stuff that might not be right that I still stand behind. That's a strong point. And the other the thing, too, that I think, you know, you see a band like Durand Jones, the indications and you would automatically think, oh, you know, there might be a riff here. But man, Barry, let me tell you, I was lucky enough to be standing next to Aaron when he came off the stage and Durand walked up to him because I walked with Durand to the backstage area and Durand walked up to him and the love, the hug and the woo that he let out for his guy was like, I got chills. I got chills about it because that is a major, major deal. And it just it just goes to show you how quality human beings that you have in front of you. I love the superhero analogy and really ever thought of it that way, because, you know, if one of those guys saves the universe, the other ones, they aren't jealous. You know, they're not they're not they're not proud. That's so true, man. That's so true. You don't see him pout because, you know, the Hulk saved the universe. Wolverine's really pissed, though, sometimes. I think that he's gets too much attention. That's true. Yeah. Maybe you catch some, you know, some of us, you know, before coffee or early in the morning, you get the Wolverine. But generally you get, you know, everybody. I just imagine Captain America therapy. I just don't appreciate it. Yeah, the Hulk got more lines than I did. Aaron, I not only can I wait to have Durand on the show now, but I can't wait to see you again. I maybe I'll run into you in L.A. I'll be there December 14th. So I can't wait for another Aaron Frazier show. I can't wait for another Durand Jones show. It got in my blood the same way, Barry. The first time I saw Alabama Shakes, the very first time I saw him at Bonnaroo. That was when it got in my blood and I just I couldn't stop after that. I think that you guys are incredible. I think that your Marvel analogy is spot on. The band's great. Your solo stuff's great. And I just I can't I can't say enough about you guys. I think you're incredible. Thank you so much. It's really fun to see again. It's fun to talk to you. Yeah, yeah, we'll see. Thank you so much. Thanks for all your time, buddy. Thank you. Aaron Frazier on the What Podcast? Barry Courter, Lord Taco, Brad Steiner. There was some more. We'll talk about Aaron Frazier here in a second, but there was some more festival news that I wanted to get to. I don't know if you guys saw the bigger breaking news that happened, I think, just yesterday. But I mean, I want to get this right because it's massive. So let me read you the headline that I saw. This is nuts, guys. One of the largest Mariachi music festivals in the U.S. returning to San Antonio, the Mariachi Vargas extravaganza taking place at Lila Cockrell Theater in December. Who's going with me? Oh, man, I can't wait. Come on. Mariachi festival. I know I couldn't get tickets. It was sold out. OK, Barry, you stick with me, buddy. I'll get you some tickets to this one. I need the V.I. for the meet and greets. Soundcheck party access. It's all with you, buddy. I promise. I want one of them hats. Yeah. Well, the real news was that if you noticed, Coachella is starting to dip a toe into the tees pool. It's just a little crumb here and there. Every few seems like days now, Coachella is wetting our palate. I fully anticipate them announcing tickets going on sale. It feels like any day now. And then, of course, if I'm not mistaken, weren't we getting lineups from them in years past or on Thanksgiving for Black Friday? Am I wrong about that? It was close. It was close because there were a lot of festivals trying to sell. Yeah. Yeah. Buy your stocking stuff or ticket type of things. Black Friday. A few of those. A lot of stocking stuffers, for sure. Which for festivals, by the way, Bonnaroo to Bonnaroo. Oh, yeah. Now it's on sale before. Yeah. Yeah. Let me ask you. Let me ask you both along those lines. I was thinking about it. And maybe I'm wrong. The timing is still not right. But it just seemed like we've spent 18 months talking about what might happen, what could happen, what is happening. Have you guys spent any time sort of analyzing what did happen? Does it does now feel like we can look back and put a put a ribbon on festival seasons, 2020 and 2021? Well, I put my ribbon in the sky. OK, I don't. Yeah. You know what I mean? Does it feel like we know anything yet or no, we're still coming out of it? I don't really know what there is to know. Right. I mean, there's do we know anything different than we had already anticipated or, you know, I'm trying I'm trying to mind my brain and see if there's something else that that's why I'm asking. I might have missed. That's why I'm asking you, especially you've been to several talk, I've been to a couple, but you, Brad, you also, you know, we make fun of you, but you have these dinners with industry people. I just wondered if there are any insights or any things that we haven't talked about that. Feels like or is it maybe not? I mean, if it's not, that's the right then that's a fine answer. I just feel like I think I think C3 were really the only ones that were willing to put themselves out there and, you know, stick with the festivals that they had, even if it felt tumultuous getting there. I don't think that at any moment, aside from a couple of times at Lollapalooza, at any moment where I really thought that, you know, people were too invested in a covid problem. Maybe I said that a little sloppy, sloppy. I didn't feel as though covid was a worry to the people who had walked into the grounds because at that point they were leaving that outside. Does that make sense? Yeah. You know, they were, you know, you you wait and wait and wait for these moments. And then you're just going to, you know, beat yourself up worrying about covid the entire time. Like, for instance, we had our first parade in New Orleans this past weekend. It was the Halloween crew of Boo Parade. Normally a lighter attended parade. It's not a Mardi Gras parade. It's mostly for kids and families. But this was as if it was Mardi Gras. People's appetite was so. I mean, they were dying for some sort of it feels like New Orleans again. So once we got in it, I don't think I even thought about covid this past weekend. And even though I was probably a little bit more, you know, I think covid is a little bit more on my mind during the festivals that I went to. You still lose yourself in these moments where it doesn't really even occur to you. And it feels normal again. And, you know, you start looking around and you see some of the ones that were successful. I think that we could have we could have probably done more, you know, I mean, you look back and yes, it's good the precautions that were taken and it's good that people didn't die and people were safe. And we remained relatively healthy and the numbers are going down. But it did feel like, you know, the ones that did go forward handled it as best as as you could have ever imagined. Well, and I think that's part of what made me think of it. And like, you know, reading the Shakin' Ease reviews earlier today, you know, a lot of them are, OK, they held the event in a different time of year and now they're ready to do it. And, you know, how they used to. And I guess that's what I'm thinking. It feels like we've we've, you know, hit a hit a turning point. And now everything is you started to say now it's start talking about lineup releases for twenty twenty two. Yeah, I mean, I don't think I don't think I feel like I hate to say it this way, but it feels like this thing is starting to dissipate. Right. And, you know. If my city is getting to a point where they're letting go of some of the mandates, they are becoming more free with with parades and festivals and gatherings, then something's really starting to move. I mean, you guys have, you know, covid didn't happen in Tennessee and Chattanooga. You guys have been in the Wild West for a year and a half. But, you know, here it's been pretty locked down. And the fact that it's starting to loosen up, if it's starting to loosen up here, then it feels like it's starting to loosen up everywhere. Yeah, that's what I'm that's what I'm that was what I was asking. Yeah. All right. I've got one other thing. Speaking of desert, speaking of Coachella, I really wanted to spend some time today talking about Dune because I have got so many thoughts about this movie. I haven't seen it yet. Well, and we will pause that conversation because I really want to hear what what TACO thinks about this movie, because he's such a David Lynch fan. He's such a David Lynch fan. This is not a David Lynch movie. I know. I know. I know. But I want to hear what you think about versus the David Lynch one. Well, have you read the book? Of course not. It's a book. Yeah. OK. What is there to talk about? Yeah. I mean, you read the book. I'm not reading 17 volumes of 800 page books. I'm not doing that. The books would fill your bus. TACO, they're huge. I have only read the first four and most of the ones after that were after Frank Herbert died, his son and a co-author tried to take it over and they're not good. They're not. Yeah. OK. Stick with the original. Well, I think that my point was I'd love to hear your takes. I've heard so many takes on every side of this. And I really want to see it. I really want to talk. Five years to see. I know. I know. You're one of these doing guys. I know. Yeah. I'm excited. I was looking forward. I'm seeing versus the David Lynch version. That's all. Well, and expectations. But I think it's right. We probably shouldn't talk about it till you've seen it. No, I don't want to. I don't want to soil anything. Yeah. Yeah. I'm hopefully going this week. What do you mean go this week to see the movie? Why would you go to see a movie? Yeah, I know. I want to see the IMAX. I don't have an IMAX screen in my house. I want to see. Yeah, I watched it on HBO Max like you did, I guess, Brad. Right. But they're showing it at IMAX theater here, too. Well, I can't see the IMAX. I can't say that I watched it. Yeah, I fell in the room twice in 45 minutes. Yeah, I mean, I'd love to talk about it. I can't wait. Well, I will hold that conversation. We'll talk about it next week. I I'm glad to see you guys. I'm glad to be back in it. And we'll we'll chat about all things due next week because honestly, it feels like its own music festival. You know, people are struggling. They're looking for, you know, spice. You know, there's a worm monster, you know. Doesn't it feel like any other festival that you go to? To me, it's the same thing. A lot of walking. Yeah, sure. So much. A lot of brooding. A lot of drugs. Naked teenage boys on the screen. I don't. Looking for liquids. Yeah. All right. There you go. What podcast? We'll talk to you next week. Love you. Bye. Consequence Podcast Network.